Overall, this film is a definite must-see for all fans of the genre - and even those who aren't! It has its trademark weird moments as did Mononoke, though to a different extreme. To me (opinion!), the story was more coherent and easier to follow than Mononoke - and Miyazaki whole-heartedly managed to create an awesome fantasy world for adults and kids alike. There's plenty of adventure, heart, and humor in this to go a long, long way...

I'm so happy Disney picked this one up... it's destined to be a classic.

Jeron

NP- Star Trek: Starfleet Academy (Ron Jones)

--Brian

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Originally posted by Jeron:

I'm so happy Disney picked this one up... it's destined to be a classic.

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A classic, so good that the Toronto Film Festival had to spend considerable efforts to convince Disney to screen SPIRITED AWAY without the lame dub job.

Subtitles are a good way for people to practice their reading skills.

Chris - I totally agree w/ you.

Jeron

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Originally posted by Scorro:
"Subtitles are a good way for people to practice their reading skills."

Most people would rather be watching the fantastic animation than practicing their reading skills on a screen.

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Most people can read fast enough to see both the subtitle and the imagery.

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Originally posted by rkeaveney:
Most people can read fast enough to see both the subtitle and the imagery.

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But it's still a bit distracting. Get over it Ryan, some of us don't mind seeing dubbed foreign films. I honestly don't mind subtitles, and can definitely see the value in READING a good translation, but I plan on saving that experience for the DVD. It's much easier to lose yourself in the world Miyazaki's created when there isn't blocky white text covering up the lower bottom portion of the screen.

For the record, I'll reiterate: the english dub is wonderful. It doesn't get much better than the job that was done on this film.

Jeron

As for the CD, well, it's great. Then again, all of Hisaishi's work is IMO. Really, with each new score of his I appreciate his work more and more. I just bought another one of his today in fact and plan on getting more soon.

Milan Records has been doing a great job of getting this stuff out, let's hope we see more and more in the future as well. Works I and Works II being on my own personal wish list right along the likes of all the other great Miyazaki-Hisaishi film work.

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Originally posted by sabbey:
I very much want to see the film but don't know of anywhere around here that is showing it. Is it a general or limited release?

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My understanding is that it goes wide next week.

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Originally posted by dgoldwas:
My understanding is that it goes wide next week.

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Thanks for the info! I'll check the movie listing in the paper...

BTW, speaking of Hisaishi's film work, does anyone have a particular favorite of his?

Regards,
Sean Robert Abbey

Kyle

Yes, and they could do simple math problems too, but what would be the point. The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of screen media is dubbed, which is why people in Europe can hear Homer Simpson speak almost every language on the continent.

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Originally posted by Scorro:
The fact of the matter is that the vast majority of screen media is dubbed, which is why people in Europe can hear Homer Simpson speak almost every language on the continent.

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Which is why I have to buy the DVDs to watch The Simpsons in a decent form. The German dub is horrible - bad & wrong translations, most of the jokes are lost. Dubs are evil, German dubs generally seem to be of pretty good quality, but 99% of them are HORRIBLE compared to the original.

Of course, it doesn't matter nearly as much if you don't speak the original language (I know exactly one Japanese word...). But believe me, as soon as you can understand the original, it's very likely that you'll find the dub disgusting. Which is why I'd rather have EVERYTHING subtitled than EVERYTHING dubbed.

Oh, and the German dubs of most animes are so horrible that I'd rather watch them in Japanese without subtitles, even if I wouldn't understand what's going on at all.

Exactly how many Japanese films, animated or otherwise, have you watched in your life? Is it just a small handful, or dozens? Because if its the latter, and you STILL prefer watching them dubbed...that's a scary prospect to consider. I have watched gobs of anime, and 10 of Kurosawa's films, and I am so used to hearing the inflections and pace used by Japanese actors that watching anything Japanese, especially anime, dubbed is a wretched experience unless there is no other option. For example, the series Cowboy Bebop. I've watched a lot of the episodes in English, and the whole series in Japanese, and I get far more enjoyment from the subbed version than the dubbed. Reading the subtitles quickly then watching the animation is easily done. You want to be a director, Jeron, so I'm sure you have respect for film as art. Would you honestly tell me that when, say, Spirited Away comes out on DVD, you'll watch the English dub over the original Japanese track and enjoy it more?

Mike

I like it both ways. Haven't watched a wide range of anime, though I did make a point of checking out "Akira" (dubbed on DVD) and "The Ghost In The Shell" (not dubbed on VHS). Contentwise I preferred TGITS, but would have liked to hear the dubbed version so I could concentrate on the action. So, there's a big thumb's up for DVD, which really does deliver for this type of issue.

Regarding "The Simpsons", you bet... if I were bilingual (or more, as many Europeans are) I would be desiring the English version. There's no way they can replace the original voices, (actually, it's hard to imagine that subtitles would work well either).

I'll make a special effort to track down a local screen showing "Spirited Away"... will buy the DVD on release, but it would be nice to see the movie at a theatre.

Hey buddy. You just had to confront me, eh? Okay, here goes. I enjoy anime, but am not a big follower of the genre. I do *enjoy* hearing the original Japanese - I never meant to imply that I didn't. I do enjoy a GOOD English dub when I hear one, though. I'm just giving kudos to the dub on Spirited Away, simply for that reason. I first saw Princess Mononoke in the original Japanese - which was great. Same with Akira. No complaints. RE: Mononoke, the English dub DID detract from the experience... Billy Bob Thornton obviously has no respect for that kind of work. Or at least it seemed as if his heart wasn't in it.

Yes, I do want to be a director; yes, I do have a respect for film as art. When Spirited Away comes out on DVD, I will watch the original Japanese track - but I can't promise that I'll enjoy it any more than what I saw opening night at the El Capitan. It's kind of hard to surpass the amount of awe-inspiredness I was experiencing then. But hey, you know what? I don't think "respecting the film as art" has anything to do with how you choose to watch it, whether you prefer the English or Japanese. Kirk Wise and his team at Disney obviously went to great lengths to protect and maintain Miyazaki's original vision. They hired GREAT voice actors and put together a kick ass dub. The mouth-motion on the characters isn't syncronized to specific words or syllabols or anything, so it isn't as if it looked odd to see English coming out of the characters' mouths. It was entirely convincing.

So, anyway... I loved the movie. I loved the dub. I loved the score. I'm sure the Japanese track is fine and offers it's own unique experience. I look forward to having that option when I get the DVD.

Jeron

PS- Just for the heck of it, I figured I'd add that I went to see Spirited Away with a buddy of mine who's a film student at USC. He's a sharp guy, very creative - and it was HIS idea to see the English dub. Why? Because he figured we'd both enjoy it more so we could SEE the movie and pay attention to every detail, rather than read and watch at the same time. Perhaps you and Ryan are extra talented, but I tend to overlook certain elements when subtitles are present. For the record, the El Capitan is showing the film with both the English dub and the original Japanese track. You have a choice.

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Originally posted by Jeron:
I do enjoy a GOOD English...I don't think "respecting the film as art" has anything to do with how you choose to watch it, whether you prefer the English or Japanese. Kirk Wise and his team at Disney obviously went to great lengths to protect and maintain Miyazaki's original vision. They hired GREAT voice actors and put together a kick ass dub...it isn't as if it looked odd to see English coming out of the characters' mouths... we'd both enjoy it more so we could SEE the movie and pay attention to every detail, rather than read and watch at the same time. For the record, the El Capitan is showing the film with both the English dub and the original Japanese track. You have a choice.

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Gotta second Jeron on all points. The dub is more than just serviceable, it's superb. The voice casting was directed by John Lasseter, no slouch in this area, and a vertiable worshipper of Miyazaki, who was also present at those recording sessions.

Language communicates more than just facts and relations. The differences between English and Japanese in how voice tone is used would lead to an inevitable loss of the emotional subtleties of the moment if one watched the film in a language other than ones own when there are translations and performances of this quality. Dramatically, for English listeners, the dub is the purer way to experience the film as Miyazaki intended.

This movie is meant to be immersive before it is to be observed. Relished before appreciated. Enjoyed before honored. The darting of the eyes from title to image would prevent a viewer from gaining much more than plot information, and there are moments, even idle ones, that are to be gazed at.

This is a great film. It is Great Cinema, outside the category of animated film - put it next to RASHOMON and NORTH BY NORTHWEST and it stands tall and proud. My advice - for your first time, experience it as it was meant to be experienced - by looking at it, by hearing it in a language whose subtleties can be conveyed to YOU fully, by feeling it. Let the parts that should wash over you do so without your having to consult the flashing screenplay. It's a movie. It's not an assignment. Later, if you want to honor a different kind of purism, stand in the language barrier and study it all you like. Those rewards are plentiful as well, but they will always be there. There will only be one first time for this delight.

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Originally posted by Jeron:
For the record, the El Capitan is showing the film with both the English dub and the original Japanese track. You have a choice.

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So which one will you see when you go again? Gonna "shake it up" a bit and see the Japanese track for comparison?

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Originally posted by dgoldwas:
So which one will you see when you go again? Gonna "shake it up" a bit and see the Japanese track for comparison?

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Nope, gonna see the English dub again. I'm taking my Aunt and my roommate - they'll enjoy it more that way, as well. Besides, I said I'd save the Japanese dub for the DVD. :-)

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Originally posted by Jeron:
Mike:

Hey buddy. You just had to confront me, eh? Okay, here goes. I enjoy anime, but am not a big follower of the genre. I do *enjoy* hearing the original Japanese - I never meant to imply that I didn't. I do enjoy a GOOD English dub when I hear one, though. I'm just giving kudos to the dub on Spirited Away, simply for that reason. I first saw Princess Mononoke in the original Japanese - which was great. Same with Akira. No complaints. RE: Mononoke, the English dub DID detract from the experience... Billy Bob Thornton obviously has no respect for that kind of work. Or at least it seemed as if his heart wasn't in it.

Yes, I do want to be a director; yes, I do have a respect for film as art. When Spirited Away comes out on DVD, I will watch the original Japanese track - but I can't promise that I'll enjoy it any more than what I saw opening night at the El Capitan. It's kind of hard to surpass the amount of awe-inspiredness I was experiencing then. But hey, you know what? I don't think "respecting the film as art" has anything to do with how you choose to watch it, whether you prefer the English or Japanese. Kirk Wise and his team at Disney obviously went to great lengths to protect and maintain Miyazaki's original vision. They hired GREAT voice actors and put together a kick ass dub. The mouth-motion on the characters isn't syncronized to specific words or syllabols or anything, so it isn't as if it looked odd to see English coming out of the characters' mouths. It was entirely convincing.

So, anyway... I loved the movie. I loved the dub. I loved the score. I'm sure the Japanese track is fine and offers it's own unique experience. I look forward to having that option when I get the DVD.

Jeron

PS- Just for the heck of it, I figured I'd add that I went to see Spirited Away with a buddy of mine who's a film student at USC. He's a sharp guy, very creative - and it was HIS idea to see the English dub. Why? Because he figured we'd both enjoy it more so we could SEE the movie and pay attention to every detail, rather than read and watch at the same time. Perhaps you and Ryan are extra talented, but I tend to overlook certain elements when subtitles are present. For the record, the El Capitan is showing the film with both the English dub and the original Japanese track. You have a choice.

[Message edited by Jeron on 09-24-2002]

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My turn to chime in again!

You make some excellent points, Jeron, and I don't have much to say in opposition. You have your reasons for liking the English dubs, and I have mine for wanting to see all my anime (or as much of it as possible) in Japanese. It's not like Ryan and I have some special skill where we can read subtitles at the speed of light, and I can't speak entirely for him, but I've just trained myself to be able to read the titles and still enjoy the animation, or the acting in the case of a Kurosawa film. I, too, saw PRINCESS MONONOKE in English the first time I saw it, since that was the only option available, and enjoyed myself. But, when I got the DVD, and could listen to the Japanese track, I was blown away even more. As good as the English voice actors may be, for any dub, I think that they still might lose something in the delivery or the emotion of the moment unless the original director is there supervising, since any American supervisor may not know exactly what the original director intended. Hopefully you get the point I'm trying to make.

As for the film, I'm going to try to see it sometime this weekend. One of the theatres around DC is showing it in Japanese (yay!), but I just have to find it since I'm still new to the area. If I get a chance to check it out, I'll be sure to let you know my thoughts and my experience with the whole thing.

Mike

Kirk Wise was the director for the US Production, and he and Miyazaki worked together to help Spirited Away make the transition from Japanese to English as best as they could. The results are astounding, and I think you'll agree, if you ever see the English dub. Don't knock it until you've tried it... I'm disappointed you would automatically assume something's lost in this translation, or in the performances. It is possible for there to be a perfect cross over - and I think Spirited Away has achieved that.

Wow, I'm feeling really redundant right about now. LOL.

RE: the score - yeah, I have it on CD. It's wonderful! As far as I know, it's the exact same disc that was released over seas, and it plays out great. It's about an hour of music, I believe. I highly recommend you pick it up, especially if you enjoy Hisaishi's other great works.

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Originally posted by Jeron:
Don't knock it until you've tried it... I'm disappointed you would automatically assume something's lost in this translation, or in the performances. It is possible for there to be a perfect cross over - and I think Spirited Away has achieved that.

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The same argument could be made for most recent animated films, where it's quite common for them to be dubbed into a foreign language. And many times, those dubs play better in those countries than the subtitled versions, because it allows the audience to get into it more. If you're talking about a dub on a live-action picture, that's one thing. But when it comes to animation, dubs don't bother me at all, since ultimately, it's all voice acting. And if you have good voice actors, you'll have a good dub. Plain and simple.

In short; this is the best film, hands down, I've seen in a theatre this year (yes, even better than SIGNS, INSOMNIA, and ONE HOUR PHOTO). Even if you don't like Japanese animation, do yourself a favor and check out this film, either in English or Japanese. You will not be disappointed.

It's THIS kind of thread that makes me love message boards (Moviemusic.com in particular). What a great, constructive discussion.

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Originally posted by Spicy Ramen:
...I rank Spirited Away along side it [Mononoke] as masterpieces of animation.
Studio Ghlibli(sp?) ...is very much like Walt Disney Studios in its early years, full of innovation and magic.

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