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Author
Topic: Nemesis goes SACD
Dinko
Romulan
Check out the upcoming releases section at varesesarabande.comVarese Sarabande promises an upcoming hybrid (plays on all CD players) SACD of Nemesis.
posted 12-11-2002 08:22 PM PT (US) SPQR
Romulan
Unless there's another 30 minutes of better music on the disc I certainly don't need to hear bip-bip-bip-bip-bip from all four corners.
posted 12-11-2002 08:57 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
I'm delighted to see that Varese Sarabande is entering the 5.1 domain! Woo. Lets hope that the cost isn't significantly above that of a regular CD release.Varese says this in their ditty: In 1979 STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE became the very first digital recording of a motion picture score.
Umm, I think they're wrong about that. Dan Wallin recorded the first digitally-recorded film score, The Black Hole.... Right?
posted 12-11-2002 09:01 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
LOL!I agree about the music and the beeps.
But I'm wondering if this means that there is a chance that in the near future we'll get multichannel DSD/SACD recordings of classic film music rerecordings by the RSNO.
posted 12-11-2002 09:03 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Mr. jonathan_little, please not that you yourself provide the answer to your question.Consider for example the following, from your post:
quote:
Originally posted by jonathan_little:
In 1979 STAR TREK: THE MOTION PICTURE became the very first digital recording of a motion picture score.Most true. Particularly note the following extract: "motion picture score".
Then consider what you say next:
quote:
Originally posted by jonathan_little:
Dan Wallin recorded the first digitally-recorded film score, The Black Hole.... Right?And again, quite true. For note the following extract: "film score".
Indeed, Star Trek was the first digital "motion picture score".
On the other hand, Black Hole was the first digital "film score".Your answer, lies within your own question.
(ok, that was the dumbest thing I have said... since well last time I posted probably)
posted 12-11-2002 09:07 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
LOL, that post was good for a laugh, at least.I wonder where Varese got their information. Even worse, I'm worried that I've been mislead all these years about The Black Hole being the first digitally-recorded score...
NP: Anthony Adverse (Korngold)
posted 12-11-2002 09:10 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
quote:
FSM's Andy Dursin says
...but there's still something distinctive and effective about Barry's music--it was also the first soundtrack that was digitally recorded--that makes you overlook how grating his main theme can be at times.I'm feeling better now.
posted 12-11-2002 09:17 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
A quick internet search reveals various sources indicating Black Hole to have been the first digitally recorded film score, and no articles about Star Trek being the first digital film score.But, the same search reveals that it might be Dick Lewzey doing the Black Hole engineering rather than Dan Wallin.
And that while Black Hole was recorded in London (at the great CTS Wembley - RIP!) Star Trek was recorded in LA.
So
Star Trek: First digital film score recorded in the USA.
The Black Hole: First digital film score recorded - ever.Maybe the confusion comes from the release dates. If the Black Hole soundtrack LP was released after the Star Trek LP, then maybe someone at Varèse confused "recorded" with "released".
What were the original release dates anyway?posted 12-11-2002 09:29 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
Wow, I never knew it was recorded in London! Come on Disney, what's your damn problem?I think Dan Wallin did mix it, his name is in the credits at the end of the film. He also has it listed on his website.
posted 12-11-2002 09:38 PM PT (US) SPQR
Romulan
My understanding is that ST: TMP was edited and mastered digitally but the actual recording itself was analog. Barry's Black Hole therefore holds the title of being the first film score recorded digitally.
posted 12-11-2002 09:39 PM PT (US) James
Romulan
Interestingly enough, the answer lies in the liner notes of Richard Band's The Day Time Ended (on a Varese LP):
quote:
The sound on this record represents a combination of regular recording technology (now referred to as "Analog") and the new digital computerized recording technique. The original twenty-four track tapes made in London in September of 1979, were mixed down into a final two-track master using the Sony PCM-1600 digital recorder...The Day Time Ended is the second original motion picture soundtrack to utilize this technique, CBS's Star Trek - The Movie having also been remixed analog-to-Sony digital.Kirk
posted 12-11-2002 09:43 PM PT (US) Beatty
Romulan
5:1. Bah.
SACD. Bah!"What is the law?"
"Animal shall not kill animal!"
"Yes, yes, yes, blah blah blah. But what is the important law?"
"Two channels for two ears! That is the law!"posted 12-11-2002 09:49 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
SPQR and Kirk, thank you for clearing that up!posted 12-12-2002 06:23 AM PT (US) Marian Schedenig
Romulan
quote:
Originally posted by Dinko:
Varese Sarabande promises an upcoming hybrid (plays on all CD players) SACD of Nemesis.Why the hell are these things always announced AFTER I buy the CD????
NP: On the Beach (Christopher Gordon)
posted 12-12-2002 07:39 AM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Marian, I know how you feel...Now wait till Warner announces they're doing an HDCD of LOTR: TTT.
posted 12-12-2002 11:34 AM PT (US) HAL 2000
Romulan
quote:
Originally posted by Marian Schedenig:
Why the hell are these things always announced AFTER I buy the CD????
[/B]I think they've taken a page out of the George Lucas school of marketing.
posted 12-12-2002 12:12 PM PT (US) Marian Schedenig
Romulan
quote:
Originally posted by Dinko:
Now wait till Warner announces they're doing an HDCD of LOTR: TTT.I'd still be happy about that, even if it meant spending more money. But Nemesis isn't exactly the score I'd buy again right now.
posted 12-12-2002 03:02 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
quote:
Originally posted by jonathan_little:
Lets hope that the cost isn't significantly above that of a regular CD release.Tower Records: $18.99
posted 12-31-2002 06:36 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
It can't be! We're film score fans, we want to be ripped off! Please say it isn't so!
posted 12-31-2002 08:27 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Well look at it this way, you get three times the music (twice in stereo and once in multichannel) for 3$ more than the average CD and 1$ less than a limited edition/fake promo.So you get 141 minutes of music for 18.99$.
posted 01-01-2003 06:13 AM PT (US) Marian Schedenig
Romulan
You also get a lot more bits on the SACD, far more than three times the amount on the CD I'm sure.NP: The Beatles 1967-1970
posted 01-01-2003 09:12 AM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Yeah, and you get more logos too.3 more to be precise:
- SACD
- DSD
- Stereo/MultichCompare the spine and back of the SACD with the regular CD
Varese is already offering it on pre-order, and it will also be available right here: http://www.moviemusic.com/CD/startreknemesis-sacd.html
posted 01-10-2003 12:19 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
A little while back, I emailed Varese asking about their claim that the Star Trek: The Motion Picture was the first digitally-recorded film score. I was under the impression that The Black Hole was the first digital film score, but let me paraphrase what they told me:- The liner notes on The Day Time Ended may be discounted, since there is a possibility that ST: TMP was recorded using two or more different technologies at the same time (which means there could have been an analog recording done with the digital one.) Varese also notes that they use at least two "recording processes" at the same time when recording their albums overseas.
- In addition, Robert Townson was told by Bruce Botnick that the score was recorded digitally over a "very long time in 1979."
I have no doubt now that ST: TMP was recorded digitally, but there still remains a question on what was the first one to begin recording. John Barry states flat out that The Black Hole was the first digital film score recording, but it seems Bruce Botnick can only offer that he did record digitally in 1979. Varese says they don't know how or when The Black Hole was recorded. From what they've written me, it appears that they just possibly assumed that ST: TMP was the first digital film score since Bruce Botnick said it was digitally-recorded in 1979.
I'm a bit upset that I still haven't gotten to the bottom of this, and I feel I have more questions than answers at this point. Still, I was quite impressed with Varese Sarabande's response. It obviously required a bit of research on their part and I greatly appreciate their time. At this point I feel like I need to write Dan Wallin and see what he says. I guess the best question is, does anybody besides me really care?
posted 01-20-2003 02:31 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Sure we care.This is probably one of the only times when someone in the soundtrack community is trying to solve a mystery or a real problem. Usually the mysteries consist of "What was the song that played during scene A?", "Who composed the score for the upcoming film X?", "Why are the same old arguments advanced everytime James Hackner releases a score?"...
Now go play some Rozsa Sherlock Holmes music and elucidate your mystery by emailing Mr. Wallin who must be wondering how much time these crazy message board fanboys have to waste.posted 01-20-2003 05:15 PM PT (US) dgoldwas
Romulan
quote:
Originally posted by Dinko:
This is probably one of the only times when someone in the soundtrack community is trying to solve a mystery or a real problem.If you change your italics to read onlin soundtrack message board community, then I'd agree with you.
Otherwise.... there are a LOT of folks in the film music community solving a "mystery" or a "deep problem" - not all of them online, and even fewer of them on fan message boards.
Dan
posted 01-20-2003 05:19 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
pffftt...picky Danster...
posted 01-20-2003 06:48 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
Yes, I'm a member of the olein soundtrack family.
posted 01-20-2003 07:13 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Iz dat ze famyli htat produßes Oil of Olay?
posted 01-20-2003 07:53 PM PT (US) Beatty
Romulan
Lena Onlin?
posted 01-21-2003 09:28 AM PT (US) Jim Ware
Romulan
Star Trek TMP was recorded from late September to late November in 1979.I think that recording for The Black Hole began in October, but I'm not certain.
posted 01-21-2003 12:05 PM PT (US) Dinko
Romulan
Mr. Wallin's email reply regarding the first digital film score:quote:
the "black Hole" was far earlier, you can look up the date on the internet,
following the "black Hole" "Annie" was recorded digitally, also before "Star Trek"
I recorded both using a 3M 48 track machine.
Cordially...Dan Wallin.So the mysterious Trek-Hole riddle was solved by Mr. Wallin.
[Message edited by Dinko on 02-03-2003]
posted 02-03-2003 04:37 PM PT (US) Marian Schedenig
Romulan
Actually, I'd rather have a nice CD boot than the SACD of Nemesis. Watched the movie today, and I really liked the score, but I still find it boring on CD. There's some great stuff that's missing from the album, including two cues closely related to bits from STTMP - one of them very The Entperise-like.
posted 02-03-2003 05:31 PM PT (US) jonathan_little
Romulan
Thank you Dinko and Dan Wallin.
posted 02-03-2003 05:53 PM PT (US) Old Infopop Software by UBB
- The liner notes on The Day Time Ended may be discounted, since there is a possibility that ST: TMP was recorded using two or more different technologies at the same time (which means there could have been an analog recording done with the digital one.) Varese also notes that they use at least two "recording processes" at the same time when recording their albums overseas.