It really is that bad for the music and annoying throughout.

Neil

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since we initially wrote this review, we've detected a number of audio/mixing errors on the DVD version of A New Hope. They are as follows:

1) The familiar Force theme trumpet fanfare that used to play right after Red Leader says: "This is it!" and just as the X-wings start diving towards the Death Star's surface has been dialed back in volume so that it's almost inaudible - it's almost completely buried in the surround mix.

2) The audio quality varies wildly as Tarkin says the line: "You would prefer another target, a military target? Then name the system." - almost as if the master sound element was damaged. It's very distracting.

3) Possibly most critically, John Williams' entire score for the film has been flipped in the rear channels, so that what should be the left rear channel is playing from the right rear channel (and vise versa). What this means is that the rear channels don't match the front channels - instruments heard from the front right channel come from the left rear instead of the right rear. Again, this is very distracting once you notice it.

These problems are certainly severe enough in our opinion to merit a repressing/exchange of the disc. We're waiting to hear back from Lucasfilm on this issue and we'll update this review with the details as soon as we do.

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So I wouldn't be buying it tomorrow if I were you.
Figures. Stupid a$$ Lucas.

Does anyone else see these big film releases to DVD always have issues? Back to the Future, ET?

Thank god Indiana Jones didn’t.

I wasn't too enthusiastic about buying these DVDs and now that I know that the music is all screwed up, I'm definitely going to stay away from them. I still haven't bought the Back to the Future set because the flawed discs are still being distributed everywhere by Universal. I refuse to plunk down $40-50 and then play a game with a movie studio just to get discs that are mastered properly.

From Force.net....

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Yesterday, Neil Burk first reported to us he felt the film score rear channels were reversed on his new copy of the Star Wars Episode IV DVD. He said he double-checked his wiring but was sure the effects where right, but the music was reversed. Today, Thedigitalbits.com reported in detail about this, also saying the rear film score channels were reversed. Prior to publishing this, we asked Lucasfilm for a statement on it. We just received it:

We are always impressed with how closely fans listen to the many different sound mixes we have made for the Star Wars movies over the years. It is flattering to know that, indeed, the audience is listening. Consequently, each mix comes out differently and any changes that you hear on the all-new Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround EX tracks on the Star Wars Trilogy DVD set are deliberate creative decisions. We can confirm that there are no technical glitches as has been reported.

If the channels are indeed reversed, this is a very curious creative decision. As everybody heads out starting tonight to get their DVDs, it remains to be seen if they agree with these particular creative decisions or not. We're anxious to hear from readers when you do get a chance to check it out in your own homes.

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Damn you Lucas!!! Damn you to Hell!!!

For real sure now he's never getting my money. It's LD>>DVD for me.

Well that's good, here's $50 that I'll never have to spend. I'll keep watching my VHS dub of the pan and scan CED.

What a disaster he has made to these films, perfect as they were in original format.

And one thing I have to say, these early episodes he has done are redundant, if they're telling the story of Anakin, then we don't need Obi Wan telling us the story again in what it's now called Episode IV.

I got the BTTF DVDs as a gift and I called their Customer Help line and a set of replacement DVDs was mailed to me at no cost I had them within 2 weeks. Very hassle free.

And how typical of Lucasfilm.

"We are always impressed with how closely fans listen to the many different sound mixes we have made for the Star Wars movies over the years. It is flattering to know that, indeed, the audience is listening. Consequently, each mix comes out differently and any changes that you hear on the all-new Dolby Digital 5.1 Surround EX tracks on the Star Wars Trilogy DVD set are deliberate creative decisions. We can confirm that there are no technical glitches as reported."

Yeah right. Bollocks!

In one sense, it was a fantastic viewing experience-- these films have never looked so fresh and exciting. The DVD production values are teriffic and just holding the box had its own unique sense to it.

It was also very bittersweet. The changes in here are indeed distracting, and not really necessary. The Emperor scene works much better having seen it in the context of the film and not online, but I still wish they'd just stuck with monkey woman (or at least the dialogue). I turned my head after Han/Greedo...they made it worse in all honesty (any editor will weep...).

And finally, yes the music is botched in that Yavin scene. Even in 2.0 you can barely hear it (and I probably only heard it because the music is mentally embedded from seeing it so many times).

I do not regret anything though. The films have always entertained me and I've remembered them exactly how I want to as the theatrical versions. The DVDs are just there to remind me to sit back and enjoy them from time to time. If they become too unbearable, there's always the VHS or LD which retain their charm much more than you may think

I reccomend the set to those with a passing or moderate interest in the movies...the die hards will most likely stick to the LD-DVD transfers, or boycott SW in general. Just enjoy the movies in whatever way suits you...that's why they were made

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Originally posted by jonathan_little:
Well, yes, I tend to go negative when corporate entities make mistakes and then say that they were actually deliberate creative decisions. I've never heard a 5.1 mix of a new or old film score that has a rear soundstage which is the opposite of the front. It's even worse when you consider how great this film score is and that the THX crew can't get it mixed properly for DVDs that have been in the pipeline for so long. I do think it's hilarious watching people on the Home Theater Forum try to explain why this messed up mix is the way it should be, contrary to the hundreds (thousands?) of 5.1 score mixes that have come before it.

[Message edited by jonathan_little on 09-21-2004]

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I know it's great to listen to the fantastic score by John Williams,with the images of the film,but 20 seconds is nothing compared with the rest of the movie.

I personally trade this 20 seconds (or even more)missing music,with the crystal clear images and sound...

NP-Dream Mixes 4 - Tangerine Dream

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I do think it's hilarious watching people on the Home Theater Forum try to explain why this messed up mix is the way it should be, contrary to the hundreds (thousands?) of 5.1 score mixes that have come before it.

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I can't believe everyone is making a fuss over a 20 seconds of music missing in a + 2 hours of movie,if you want to listen to the music,just put the soundtrack on....

I know it's great to listen to the fantastic score by John Williams,with the images of the film,but 20 seconds is nothing compared with the rest of the movie.

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Originally posted by Indysolo:
Because the Home Theater Forum, a site formerly made up of A/V enthusiasts, has been overtaken by the average consumer. They'll accept anything.

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I know it's great to listen to the fantastic score by John Williams,with the images of the film,but 20 seconds is nothing compared with the rest of the movie.<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE>
You do realize that the music on Star Wars (now called "A New Hope") is entirely screwed up throughout the entire 124 minute running time, right?

Neil[/b]<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE>

No i didn't know that,because the only example that everyone throws around,is that 20 seconds of music on the Deathstar attack...

I haven't seen any other example,however i will see them in a couple of days,so maybe here in Europe things are diferent,who knows?

NP - The Hunted - Brian Tyler

Nuno Cunha

The change was hardly distracting for me. I guess that just makes me less of discerning or not worthy of this discussion...

On a serious note, the documentary is fantastic. Yes, it is a little bit of an egofest for Lucas, but when you see what it took to hold the original production together I have more respect for the man.

I now understand his reasons for making the changes...because he simply could not make the film he wanted to in 1976. If you don't like the new versions...too bad...I guess you were never truly meant to enjoy it. OK...that may be a little harsh as well.

If folks are so nostalgic for the originals, plug in your VCR and watch them, crap stereo sound, crap video and all. After all, that was the original experience you loved so much.

But wait...we just want the original cut with remastered sound and video. Are we then really purists or actually hyprocrits.

Hmmm...I will ponder that while I watch the The Empire Strikes Back in its beautiful glory.

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Originally posted by Quill:
If folks are so nostalgic for the originals, plug in your VCR and watch them, crap stereo sound, crap video and all. After all, that was the original experience you loved so much.

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That Oscar no longer means anything as this new mix is a bastard representation of what Star Wars used to be.

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Originally posted by Indysolo:

Star Wars featured an Oscar winning sound mix. It was not "crap stereo sound". It still isn't. And it had the music presented properly.

That Oscar no longer means anything as this new mix is a bastard representation of what Star Wars used to be.

Neil

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How is the music presented improperly on the DVD's? Just because the rears are reversed, that doesn't mean anything. If you are complaing that much, just unplug your speakers. Good god, you people are treating this like it's the end of the world. Can't you just be happy the picture and sound is as clear as it is? At least you got Star Wars on DVD!!!

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Originally posted by scoreguy16:
At least you got Star Wars on DVD!!!

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That's the wrong way to think of things. This is an awesome score and the treatment it received for this release is unacceptable. Just for comparison, Paramount created a great sounding 5.1 mix of Black Sunday and released the movie for $5.50 on DVD. Then we have Lucasfilm who can't get Star Wars' score mixed properly, even with a team of people working on the film.

Anyway, the IMDB ran a story today on this messed up DVD. You can read about it here.

The main thing is this, there's no way Lucasfilm would pull all these DVDs to correct the issue. Which is really a sad as Fox did a great job replacing those second discs of "Cleopatra" when all that was missing was the exit music.

Why is it that all the fan favs that finally make it to DVD are totally screwed up? "E.T.," "Back to the Future," and now "Star Wars."

James

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Originally posted by Quill:
Oscar-winning for the time, my friend. By today's standards it is crap. Sorry.

Was it snowing when you walked uphill both ways to school back then too?

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A work of art is like a snapshot of the time it was made. Just think of what would happen if we were to go back and "repair" every piece of art that's "crap" by today's standards. Should we re-record all the dialogue, music and sound effects in Casablanca so it can compete with current Hollywood productions?

Moreover, even if the films Lucas wanted to make were never made, the George Lucas who is putting together these special editions of the Star Wars films is not the same George Lucas who made them in the past. He's been separated by more than 20 years of experience. Terry Gilliam said that looking back on Brazil he saw many things he would like to do differently, but he wouldn't want to go back and change them because as it stands the film is a record of who the filmmaker was at that moment. When George Lucas made Star Wars in 1977, he was a young, exhuberant, ambitious director with a big future ahead of him and big ideas, who had to deal with lots of restrictions getting his vision to the screen--and to quote Nicholas Meyer, "Art thrives on restrictions." Now Lucas is a seasoned, almost complacent producer with anything he wants at his fingertips and more interest in pleasing his kids than anything else. I'm not saying there's anything wrong with this new Lucas, I'm just saying he's not the same person.

I feel that a film's restoration should never go beyond trying to make it look or sound any better than it did when it was initially created. But regardless of my personal feelings about that issue, and my general dislike of surround sound (you heard me), it is also quite correct to say that these are Lucas's films and if he wants to fiddle around with them, that's his business. Honestly, on it's most essential level, I have no problem with that whatsoever.

What I do have a problem with is that Lucas simultaneously suppresses the original films. There is no good reason that two versions of each film can't peacefully coexist. If the original versions were also available, it's likely I (and I assume many others) would see the special editions as interesting and entertaining companion pieces. There's simply no logical reason (other than holding out for more money) to suppress the original versions.

And to hell with that "just be thankful it's on DVD" crap. This isn't some obscure film that was thought to be lost but was later found in a landfill somewhere in Istanbul that gots its new sound mix screwed up. I can live with the crappy video and sound on my bootleg VHS copy of the 1933 Alice in Wonderland because I'm just thankful it exists at all. But this is frickin' Star Wars, one of the most popular, influential, and beloved films of all time, controlled by one of the richest, most powerful figures in cinema history. There's no good reason the DVD transfer shouldn't be top-notch.

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Originally posted by Indysolo:
You and me both, Mr. Little. Even Robert Harris has praised the set at the HTF, and I'm on a final warning there, simply for talking about a mistake made to a DVD!

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I'm not surprised that they'd like to ban you given Ron Epstein's most recent completely idiotic statement:

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After all, we are talking about music not surround effect/dialogue information.

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In the meantime, I have lost all respect for that board and the majority of the sheep there that frequent it.

That being said, I love seeing FSM'rs and MovieMusic.com people defending this classic film score with the Joe Six-Packs that now dominate that board. Film score lovers still seem to have integrity!

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Originally posted by Indysolo:
Jonathan, the people at the HTF obviously enjoy free DVDs and THX tours more than they like having integrity. The attitude displayed there by three moderators (Michael Reuben, Jack Briggs and Ron Epstein) shows a total lack of dedication to getting the best out of our home theaters. Clearly someone somewhere is trying to keep this issue out of the spotlight.

In the meantime, I have lost all respect for that board and the majority of the sheep there that frequent it.

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Uhm...

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Originally posted by Indysolo:
That being said, I love seeing FSM'rs and MovieMusic.com people defending this classic film score with the Joe Six-Packs that now dominate that board. Film score lovers still seem to have integrity!

Neil

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I just watched my VHS copy of Star Wars that as released in 1995. I love watching the old special effects, but the VHS video, you know how it deteriorates from repeated playing. I must get one of those laserdisc-DVD transfers.

I honestly didn't think I'd realise where the botch was, but it was blatantly obvious. It probably doesn't sound like a mistake to someone whose watching them for the first time, but the omission is quite annoying if you're used to the score.

I watched ANH for a second time last night, and honestly this issue is a "who cares" for me. Lucas is footing the bill for these releases...if he feels the originals were an incomplete version of his vision then he can do whatever he damn well pleases.

I for one feel the mix is acceptable...the picture quality is outstanding. I will take this 5.1 digital mix over the horrid analog versions I have been plagued with for so long.

As I clearly stated, I don't care how much Goerge Lucas wants to meddle with his own films. You are absolutely correct in that regard. They are his to meddle with. I just think it's both altruistic and historically important to have both versions available in whatever format will provide the best preservation. If Spielberg (despite the questionable release tactics) can put out both cuts of E.T....hell, if Criterion can put out two cuts of Luchino Visconti's The Leopard...then George Lucas can afford to put out two cuts of Star Wars.

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Originally posted by Bond1965:
Why is it that all the fan favs that finally make it to DVD are totally screwed up? "E.T.," "Back to the Future," and now "Star Wars."

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Actually, I think it's more a question of mathematics than anything else. Those films each have an exceptionally large fan base, literally millions of people who know every inch of every frame inside-out. Ergo, glitches are noticed by many, many people and since the DVDs will be big sellers, the problems become big news. On the other hand, if there was something wrong with the DVD release of, say, Dziga's Vertov's Man with a Movie Camera, how many people would notice? And by the same token, if there was something wrong with the DVD release of Double Team starring Jean-Claude Van Damme and Dennis Rodman, who would care?

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Originally posted by James:
And by the same token, if there was something wrong with the DVD release of Double Team starring Jean-Claude Van Damme and Dennis Rodman, who would care?

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LOL...

Imagine the outrage...