Booyah!

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How did you do that (with what software?)? I'd like to try it.

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Simple MAGIX work, it took me two minutes. I simply layered the two pieces on top of each other and balanced the volume.
If you mail me, I can send you the piece.

quote:

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Originally posted by gkgyver:
<BLOCKQUOTE><font size=1 face=arial>quote:</font><HR size=1>How did you do that (with what software?)? I'd like to try it.
<HR size=1></BLOCKQUOTE>

Simple MAGIX work, it took me two minutes. I simply layered the two pieces on top of each other and balanced the volume.
If you mail me, I can send you the piece.

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Originally posted by NeoVoyager:
Why? That is a very non-descriptive name, in my opinion. Sure, it's classic, but it really doesn't explain what this thread is about to those who don't already know.

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Perhaps the best would be to keep the basic name but augment it to be more accurate:

LotR - The Complete Recordings package update.

quote:

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Originally posted by Timdalf:
Originally posted by NeoVoyager:
Why? That is a very non-descriptive name, in my opinion. Sure, it's classic, but it really doesn't explain what this thread is about to those who don't already know.

Perhaps the best would be to keep the basic name but augment it to be more accurate:

LotR - The Complete Recordings package update.

Timdalf

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Bravo!

"LotR Complete Recordings Update" ... doesn't sound nice?<<<

We likes it, we does, my preshuss!!

Oh, they're tricksy and calls us nameses, they does!!! They calls us "young"!!!

"Take back the lies, the hurt, the blame...." sob! sob! (whine, whinge!)

In other words, just add an 's', since there are certainly more updates than one.

quote:

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Originally posted by gkgyver:
I don't know what you're doing, but I can visit the site without problems.

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Are you serious? You can see it fine?

Can everyone see it?

I dunno why I wasn't able to see it for a few days there. Like I said, I could view the cache on Google, but I couldn't view the actual site or anything... I even tried clearing my temporary internet files and stuff...

Weird.

Anyways, thanks for the kind offer, but it looks like the problem solved itself in the last few hours. Enjoy your listening!

EDIT: Wow, thanks to everyone who e-mailed me the score before I could post this reply. Your generosity is much appreciated!

...I LOVE IT!!! The White Rider in Nature

I ordered my copy today from AMAZON, a few minutes ago!!!!!!

What a relief

DOUG........How's the new work coming along???

Moments ago we received this email from Peter Jackson and his crew down in New Zealand, take a look...

Dear One Ringers,

As you know, there's been a lot of speculation about The Hobbit. We are often asked about when or if this film will ever be made. We have always responded that we would be very interested in making the film - if it were offered to us to make.

You may also be aware that Wingnut Films has bought a lawsuit against New Line, which resulted from an audit we undertook on part of the income of The Fellowship of the Ring. Our attitude with the lawsuit has always been that since it's largely based on differences of opinion about certain accounting practices, we would like an independent body - whether it be a judge, a jury, or a mediator, to look at the issues and make an unbiased ruling. We are happy to accept whatever that ruling is. In our minds, it's not much more complex than that and that's exactly why film contracts include right-to-audit clauses.

However, we have always said that we do not want to discuss The Hobbit with New Line until the lawsuit over New Line's accounting practices is resolved. This is simple common sense - you cannot be in a relationship with a film studio, making a complex, expensive movie and dealing with all the pressures and responsibilities that come with the job, while an unresolved lawsuit exists.

We have also said that we do not want to tie settlement of the lawsuit to making a film of The Hobbit. In other words, we would have to agree to make The Hobbit as a condition of New Line settling our lawsuit. In our minds this is not the right reason to make a film and if a film of The Hobbit went ahead on this basis, it would be doomed. Deciding to make a movie should come from the heart - it's not a matter of business convenience. When you agree to make a film, you're taking on a massive commitment and you need to be driven by an absolute passion to want to get the story on screen. It's that passion, and passion alone, that gives the movie its imagination and heart. To us it is not a cold-blooded business decision.

A couple of months ago there was a flurry of Hobbit news in the media. MGM, who own a portion of the film rights in The Hobbit, publicly stated they wanted to make the film with us. It was a little weird at the time because nobody from New Line had ever spoken to us about making a film of The Hobbit and the media had some fun with that. Within a week or two of those stories, our Manager Ken Kamins got a call from the co-president of New Line Cinema, Michael Lynne, who in essence told Ken that the way to settle the lawsuit was to get a commitment from us to make the Hobbit, because "that's how these things are done". Michael Lynne said we would stand to make much more money if we tied the lawsuit and the movie deal together and this may well be true, but it's still the worst reason in the world to agree to make a film.

Several years ago, Mark Ordesky told us that New Line have rights to make not just The Hobbit but a second "LOTR prequel", covering the events leading up to those depicted in LOTR. Since then, we've always assumed that we would be asked to make The Hobbit and possibly this second film, back to back, as we did the original movies. We assumed that our lawsuit with the studio would come to a natural conclusion and we would then be free to discuss our ideas with the studio, get excited and jump on board. We've assumed that we would possibly get started on development and design next year, whilst filming The Lovely Bones. We even had a meeting planned with MGM executives to talk through our schedule.

However last week, Mark Ordesky called Ken and told him that New Line would no longer be requiring our services on the Hobbit and the LOTR 'prequel'. This was a courtesy call to let us know that the studio was now actively looking to hire another filmmaker for both projects.

Ordesky said that New Line has a limited time option on the film rights they have obtained from Saul Zaentz (this has never been conveyed to us before), and because we won't discuss making the movies until the lawsuit is resolved, the studio is going to have to hire another director.

Given that New Line are committed to this course of action, we felt at the very least, we owed you, the fans, a straightforward account of events as they have unfolded for us.

We have always had the greatest support from The Ringers and we are very sorry our involvement with The Hobbit has been ended in this way. Our journey into Tolkien's world started with a phone call from Ken Kamins to Harvey Weinstein in Nov 1995 and ended with a phone call from Mark Ordesky to Ken in Nov 2006. It has been a great 11 years.

This outcome is not what we anticipated or wanted, but neither do we see any positive value in bitterness and rancor. We now have no choice but to let the idea of a film of The Hobbit go and move forward with other projects.

We send our very best wishes to whomever has the privilege of making The Hobbit and look forward to seeing the film on the big screen.

Warmest regards to you all, and thanks for your incredible support over the years.

New Line and Co. are shooting themselves in the foot, so to speak, I think. #1, it is very difficult to come by a director with the vision and talent that Peter invested in LotR. #2, the movie-going public simply isn't going to be as excited about a Hobbit movie (or 'LotR prequel') being made by an entirely different team.

I think they're 'tripping over a dollar to pick up a dime,' so to speak.

Oh well. My deepest regrets that it had to end this way.

Edit:

An absolutely HORRIFYING thought occurred to me just as I pressed 'Submit.'

Does this jeopardize or exterminate plans for RotK: The Complete Recordings. Please tell me no! Please!

Today they've gone and undone that very favour...because like our dear, dear Peter Jackson said, they got to go there, but not back again.

It is extremely sad that a movie studio could let down a filmmaker with so much passion for a story, and respect for its author, in the face of "rights".

I suppose fans worldwide loathe them from the depths of their souls (though I say this without any authority, of course), but I know that I feel horrible right now. And I can't even imagine what poor Peter Jackson and his entire team must have gone through when they received that call.

Peter Jackson, if you're reading this, you have my deepest sympathy. Always know that you are the best person to make The Hobbit, even if you don't get to do so. Because its not about the movie, its about the people behind it. We've seen your passion during LOTR, you were our Hobbit then, and you'll be our Hobbit now.

This goes goes a long, long way in proving that vile difference between the filmmaker and the studio - one with a passion for the movie, another with a passion for the money.

And since I'm speaking only for myself, I must confess they've spoilt everything for me, my dreams of sitting in a dark cinema hall as the lights go down, listening to Howard Shore's music scale over a familiar marquee, and watching a Hobbit movie backed by the very same LOTR team.

No. They haven't just spoilt The Hobbit for me, they've spoilt LOTR for me.

I don't think I can stand buying any more LOTR stuff (not to mention the CRs) not when Mr.Shore has mentioned he'd like to connect the movies, and especially not if the movies aren't connected by Peter Jackson.

No. Its all spoilt for me. Its been tainted by selfish interests, and if New Line could (please excuse my language, I'm heating up now) screw one of the most anticipated movies of one of the largest fan communities existing in the world this side of the millennium, I can see where price tags like $75 for TTT:CR and possibly $100 for ROTK:CR are coming from.

Subduing an artist's creativity like this is the most despicable thing that a movie studio as big as New Line could ever do. It just plain sucks.

How I wish I was born rich and could seriously kick some studio ass right now.

The world has changed. I need to get a hold of myself right now, and I don't think I shall return to this forum, not until Peter Jackson returns to Middle Earth.

quote:

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Originally posted by Earl Ignatius Carvalho:

The world has changed. I need to get a hold of myself right now, and I don't think I shall return to this forum, not until Peter Jackson returns to Middle Earth.

[Message edited by Earl Ignatius Carvalho on 11-20-2006]

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I agree with many things in your post, E.I.C., but aren't you thinking this is a bit far-fetched?

If not -I'm resorting to mild sarcasm here-, well, then you should go the whole way and bin everything LotR-related you have. But I have a hunch that this will not happen I'd hate to lose your contributions to this board.

I'm quite unhappy about this myself, but better this way, i.e. not at all, than in some half-hearted way. Should it be done by somebody else indeed (both direction and music-wise), well...I make my decision right here and now insofar as that I will surely NOT watch it. PJ and crew have nailed Middle-Earth so absolutely pitch-perfect that I cannot and do not want to picture another (and possibly inferior) version of it. Ever.

As for those panic attacks some are having about RotK Complete...hold them off until you have a real, solid reason to panic. Then, I will most certainly join in, because as our esteemed Basil fawlty once remarked about panicking: WHAT ELSE IS THERE TO DO?! (breaks down with hysteric sobs)

Heads up, people. It's not all days' evening yet, as the saying voer here goeth...

CK

This will backfire on them... It is thinking $$$ not art. It is the persistant bane of the movie BUSINESS, to think of it not as art but as a cash cow.

I doubt any decent director or film firm will take on The Hobbit with this cloud since New Line will have tarnished their rep for honest dealings, so whatever comes out of it will indeed rank alongside previous travesties of the book.

I also doubt if this will affect the Complete Recordings, at least I hope not.

Again, this is VERY short-sighted of New Line... they will end up the real losers especially in box office if they persist in this tactic.

If they have real business acumen, they would make a $$$ offer to Wingnut for the LotR funds due that indeed they could not refuse (in the nice sense), settle the lawsuit out of court (and save everybody lots of $$$) and get on with making what will be one of (or two of) the highest grossing films ever with a tried team of PJ, Wingnut, Weta and Shore...

And by the way here is the full conclusion to the original TORN post quoted by Olorin:

>>>...We got to go there - but not back again ...

Peter Jackson and Fran Walsh

Xoanon here, this is a big blow to the LOTR community. I feel like there has been a death in the family... there are a LOT of questions that will remain unanswered for the time being. Why couldn't New Line come to an agreement with PJ? Is there really a time option on the film rights for New Line? Who will they get to direct? Those are some massive shoes to fill if you ask me. I hope that whoever they get to direct will not try something 'new' with the look and feel of PJ's Middle-earth... and what is this LOTR 'prequel' project?

There have been rumors about The Hobbit being split into two films, will this prequel project then become the third film in another trilogy? Who knows...

I'm sure Peter and Fran aren't going to want to talk more about this, but that doesn't mean we won't be begging for a sitdown and chat! Stay tuned for more...<<<

Timdalf

I'm sorry if I came across as too harsh, its just that this forum is the first place I come to when LOTR stuff happens, and I often write out things as they go on inside my head.

And when I said I wouldn't be coming back here, it wasn't because anyone here has anything to do with anything. Its because I suddenly didn't want to be a part of something that was brought into existence by an uncaring studio.

I'm not saying that if The Hobbit is made by anyone else it woun't be good enough. It might be great. But that's not the point. The point is that this is OUR story. A studio has no right to "do as it deems fit" (or maybe they do, coz they've shown it).
Its the fact that what belongs to everyone can be marred because it is controlled by only a few - and those few that don't care.

Think about it. Hasn't New Line thought about the consequences? I suppose they have, but you what? They've probably thought it out all wrong.

They think they can find a great director, a great cast, a great etc etc and make a great movie...and of course rake in millions of dollars. Probably. But consider this:

1. No "original" Bag End set (lovingly stored away for The Hobbit)
2. No "original" Bilbo's Trolls (lovingly stored away for The Hobbit as well)
3. No "original" WETA-effects (obviously not)
4. No "original" One Ring (but what the hell is the difference between 2 random rings of gold?)
5. No "original" portrait of Peter Jackson and Fran Walsh above the fireside (now that would be overkill)
6. No "original" Thror's Map (only fans would care)
7. No "original" Sting (again its the fan-factor)
8. No "original" Rivendell (its a big place, and I suppose they can do what they want and there'd be no visible difference)
9. No "original" Red Book (fan-factor)
10. No "original" Hobbit-feet (which took over a year to perfect, by the way)

These are just 10 reasons off the top of my (now heated) head.

The point of all this is simple: I can't understand how New Line could suddenly be "looking to hire another filmmaker". It goes a long, long way in saying exactly how much they value the artistic and creative value of the film.

This forum was a place where common people shared beautiful insights about a beautiful score written to a beautiful movie adapted from a beautiful book.

And that beauty has suddenly been lost in the way that New Line has just gone and dropped Peter Jackson out of it all. What appalls me is how one phone call could put an abrupt end to everything.

I'm tired of nice things being spoilt over something as silly as money. Maybe money means a lot to some people. I care not.

But I say again. This story "emotionally" belongs to us as much as it "legally" belongs to New Line (and MGM).

Maybe I was a bit hastly in writing what I did, but I'll leave it there nonetheless.

If there's anything I regret I said, its concerning the scores. I won't let them take that away from me. Maybe lost in all the big budgets of billions of dollars, some poeple don't realize that a simple line of music can mean so much to a single person somewhere in this world.

No. I'm sorry Doug. And I'm sorry Mr.Shore. And I'm sorry forum members. We have a good thing going on here, and let's keep it that way.

If more people thought less about money, this world would be a better place.

Edit: And Christian, I would never throw anything into a waste paper basket. I have too much respect for works of art. I'd probably give it to someone who still remained a fan(atic).

I'll let you know if I get to that stage, I have some great LOTR memorabilia I wouldn't mind sharing And thanks for the eye-opener that encouraged this post.

>>>If more people thought less about money, this world would be a better place.<<<

Earl, do please calm down a bit... I agree this is a stupid move by New Line on both artistic grounds and even monetary. But ever has it been thus in Hollywood. Films are financially huge projects and to ignore the money means ending up like Orson Welles... great genius, but failing projects.

Had PJ and Wingnut merely taken the easy course of not treating New Line like a film studio (i.e., as a business institution) then things might have gone on, but on what basis for the former...? They too have to keep their eye on the money ball... This is an unfortunate reality of making films.

Further, remember there is a large group of LotR fans who despise The Film for its deviations from Tolkien... Not least among them is the Tolkien Estate itself! So in their eyes all is not so rosy with Wellywood! And they too are getting corrupted by the $$$ (or in their case Pounds Sterling, or is it Euros now?)... There are many projects the Estate has squelched outright rather than merely tried to guide and improve. So the corrupting influence of money-think is not limited to New Line...

Again, let's not assume this is the last word on all this. This turn of events is less than 24 hours old... When New Line looks at the financial impact of this old line (pun alert!) then let us hope they come to their senses.......

The very Shire too needed scouring... Sharkey is not completely dead yet!

Timdalf

But you know what the *really* sad thing is? No matter who will helm the project now, he will most likely just try to redo Jackson anyway.
Oh, how I can hear the director now "You know, I'm a huge fan of Peter Jackson and his films, and his vision of Rivendell was just perfect. We tried to keep enough of the original designs to make fans think they are watching something familiar, but at the same time add something new because, you know, it's a new film."

Having said that, I'm quite sad that it won't happen for this reason. If it isn't going to happen, then I wish the reasons contained a little more integrity to them.

Someone talked about 'us'... meaning the LOTR fan base. But as I understand it, a large component of the pre-existing LOTR fan base was highly opposed to the movie. Many still are. I myself have multiple cringe and annoyance moments with the movies. But I do believe that Tolkien set out to write myth and it is the nature of myth that it get interpreted and reinterpreted. It was how I reconciled PJ's version of LOTR. It was his version. Not mine. He treated the material with enough respect that I could respect his right to interpret it. If I can accept one... then I can accept another. I will evaluate every attempt to approach Middle-earth on it's own merits and not accept only one. In fact, the thought of accepting PJ's version as the only and definitive version is a bit distasteful to me.

We might see a completely different approach and it might move us in ways we never expected.

As to the music, I would dearly love to see Shore score PJ's film. But the image and music seemed so tied in our minds. Can we accept the music tied to a completely different vision? I'm sure Howard can do anything. lol. But, without PJ, would he be able to do the same thing that he did in LOTR? Or will he need to change his approach? If he changes and adapts, will the fans accept it? One comment on another board said simple, "Change happens. Accept it." We can't hold onto things so dearly that we deny ourselves new experiences or preserve the broken shreds of what we can clutch. I hate change and endings (read my personal notes for the last few ROTK cue by cues.) But I'm old enough to know that it doesn't matter how much I hate change it happens. And sometimes, life is actually better for it.

And I can't end my long Magpie-ish missive here without tying it back to Tolkien. The attempt to 'preserve' is a strong Tolkien subject. There is a really good passage about this in Verlyn Flieger's Splintered Light. To quote briefly (as I can) from Chapter 170, One Good Custom:

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The strongest evidence for Tolkien’s certainty of the necessity for change is in his invention of the immortal and changeless Elves, whom... he described as “embalmers.” Their desire to arrest change is exemplified (in) his notion... of what not to do. “Mere change as such,” he wrote of his invented world, “is not represented as ‘evil’; it is the unfolding of the story and to refuse this is of course against the design of God. But the Elvish weakness is in these terms naturally to regret the past, and to become unwilling to face change... They desired some power over things as they are... to arrest change, and keep things always fresh and fair” (Letters 236)

Desire to preserve a present good inevitably becomes desire to keep it from passing, but his leads to stagnation. The process of change is part of the design, and must continue if the design is to be fulfilled.

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I strongly believe New Line will come to their senses. Like it is said some posts above : there are so many disadvantages.

If anyone here hasn't read the letter sent from 'Mr. Cere' at TORN to NewLine/MGM, then they can find it here:
http://www.theonering.net/perl/newsview/8/1158344995
This was sent in mid-September when rumors started flying. This letter is a great example of what I consider integrity - in many ways. It does a nice job (for me) of stating what this fans needs for me to be behind a Hobbit film.

and... for what it's worth:
MGM/UA: CEO Harry E. Sloan and COO Rick Sands, 10250 Constellation Blvd., Los Angeles, CA 90067-6421

New Line Co-Chairmen and Co-CEOs Robert K. Shaye and Michael Lynne at 888 7th Ave., Fl. 19, New York, NY 10106

quote:

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Originally posted by Magpie:
Sorry for posting again... I'll have to clean up that html/bbcode mismash that happens if I try to edit.

If anyone here hasn't read the letter sent from 'Mr. Cere' at TORN to NewLine/MGM, then they can find it here:
http://www.theonering.net/perl/newsview/8/1158344995
This was sent in mid-September when rumors started flying. This letter is a great example of what I consider integrity - in many ways. It does a nice job (for me) of stating what this fans needs for me to be behind a Hobbit film.

and... for what it's worth:
MGM/UA: CEO Harry E. Sloan and COO Rick Sands, 10250 Constellation Blvd., Los Angeles, CA 90067-6421

New Line Co-Chairmen and Co-CEOs Robert K. Shaye and Michael Lynne at 888 7th Ave., Fl. 19, New York, NY 10106

[Message edited by Magpie on 11-20-2006]

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That letter is so well-written and thoughtful that, if it ever arrived at those it was addressed to, it would have flown a few miles above their heads.

Hollywood doesn't think that way, sadly.