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Originally posted by Earl:
And as for me, I've stopped caring about The Hobbit too.

Sam Raimi, Peter Jackson, Bob Shaye... they can make it and watch it themselves for all I care right now.

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Originally posted by Magpie:
Is anyone actively working on the LOTR Score Analysis Project?

http://www.kilohertz.nl/lotr-sap/index.php

For my own site, I'm compiling lists of CR occurrences of certain themes with timestamps. This information could be added to Score Project but I don't have time to do it. I'd be willing to email the info to anyone who has the time and inclination to enter the information in.

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Recently, a few weeks ago, I bought the single disc soundtracks, and listened to them straight away. Whilst I really loved some of the alternate takes of FOTR, I was frustrated with TTT being here and there, and it just didn't feel.......together - Where was Merry & Pippin in that - no where to be heard......
I then finally came to ROTK, now the night before I bought the soundtracks - $10AUS a piece, over a very long time, I slowly watched the film for its music, and the soundtrack ---- the worst soundtrack experience, it was like a was watching a really long trailer - the best bits were missing, such as when the beacon (light) is lit (excuse me for my terminology, I don't know all that much about it, but I love the music). An interesting and yet horrifying experience!!!! (did that (all three) even go for the length that the CR:FOTR went for???...)

>>>>>DA: ------ Very well, thanks! I'm in the cusp of the next draft of the liners. Disc one track titles are now under consideration as well. We're marching forwards!<<<<<

AT LAST - !!!INFORMATION!!! - THHHAAAANNNK YOUUUU DOUG (I write this with great joy, whilst I listen to Jerry Goldsmith's RAMBO: FIRST BLOOD PART II Soundtrack – I can see some light, we must be getting closer to the end of the tunnel.

A question that came to my head whilst listening to the music in EE:ROTK - What is going to be the length of the longest running track in ROTK:CR??? - I could almost picture a track running at least 30 minutes in length.....how about it Doug???

Also, from previous posts, finding out that it will probably be around 4 hours and 30 minutes in length, -
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>>>>>> - >>>OK, question #1 on everyone's mind: How loooong is the first edit? As in "the longer the better"!!>>>

DA: As promised, four very full discs.<<<<<<

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- I'm getting very excited of what was missed out in the film, and considering, that EE:ROTK didn't even go for 4 hours and 30 minutes.

I hope what I am about to say is not the case, and is proved wrong, but I have a feeling that the last disc is going to contain all the music from the Fan Credits of all three films................please, don't let this be the case, I want to hear 4 hours and 30 minutes of Return Of The King music......

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Originally posted by THX 1138 4eb:
the best bits were missing, such as when the beacon (light) is lit

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If you could elaborate on this subject Doug, it would be much appreciated.

It seems on the OST there is resolution within the harmonic progression before the grand statement of the Gondor theme (in other words we arrive at what seems like tonic). The film's version leaves us hanging, waiting for a resolution, which leads into the Gondor theme. I guess the grand statement of the Gondor theme acts as the resolution for the previous bars (baaaaaahhhh, badadum, badadum, baaaaahhhhhhhhhhhh!!!!!!!!!)

I remember sitting in the theater being a little shocked at hearing this unresolved version (only because I had listened to the OST many, many times before seeing the film). Now that I am used to both versions I can't really decide which I like better. They both work in different ways.

I hope they include the film version in the CR so that we can have both versions on CD in one form or another.

Yes, I must agree with you here. The ROTK OST was disappointing to me mainly because it is missing several cues that I really love - such as the music you hear when Rohan finally arrives at Pelennor Fields and Theoden gives his rousing speech. The Horn of Rohan cue is missing, the Mumakil horn blowing signaling their attack is also missing.

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Originally posted by Jim Ware:
Although it is a different take with slightly different timings and orchestrations. The last few bars before the Gondor theme appears are the most obvious difference.

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Yes, it's either a vastly different mix, or a differently written and orchestrated version. Those brass counterpoints don't sound very similar in the two versions. I suppose we'll get the film version in the CR, as the other version is already on the OST release. I clearly prefer the OST version, so I'd rather have it the other way round...

Sorry to be the one to break the bad news, but those rousing horn calls will most likely NOT be there on the CRs. If I remember correctly, Doug mentioned sometime ago that this was due to the fact that the horns weren't really a part of the "score" per se.

This is also the reason why the Orc horn calls at the Black Gate in TTT aren't there on the CR - they were sounds made by musical instruments, yes, but they weren't part of the score as composed by Shore.

So my guess is these horns won't be featured either.

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I wonder if those horn blowing (cues?) will be added to the ROTK CR?

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I wonder how many times this question has been asked now?

Sorry about that Marian Schedenig, but I have only listened to the OST a couple of times, although, that small piece of music, when Aragorn sees that the Beacons are lit, and runs and tells Theoden, even though it is a short cue, it is missing from the OST, and maybe that's were I went wrong in my thinking. I personally feel as though that short piece completes the scene.....

Doug, are those two sections of music going to be pieced together, or is the later going to be a short track following the Beacon track?????

!!!!! THANKS FOR YOUR THOUGHTS AND INFORMATION !!!!!

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Originally posted by THX 1138 4eb:
I have only listened to the OST a couple of times, although, that small piece of music, when Aragorn sees that the Beacons are lit, and runs and tells Theoden, even though it is a short cue, it is missing from the OST, and maybe that's were I went wrong in my thinking. I personally feel as though that short piece completes the scene.....

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Actually we do see Aragorn while the whole beacon sequence is still finishing, and the short cue being played for his run is a good opening for the forthcoming Rohan gathering theme.

P.S.: I love the OST Lightning of the Beacons version, but the film version is much more complete and interesting to me, and that strings work in there is just fantastic! Does anybody hear inconsistencies between the EE DVD chapter menu music and the film (for instance, The Siege of Gondor)? I guess there were plenty of performances recorded so no surprises that OST sounds very different.

Only a few questions, so only a few answers!

>>>Doug, are those two sections of music going to be pieced together, or is the later going to be a short track following the Beacon track?????>>>

The track breaks are currently being discussed, as are track titles, so comments are a bit premature. The two sections were recorded separately, however, just fyi. Also remember, a track break does not necessarily indicate any specific length of silence between the compositions -- that’s adjustable. I can at least tell you that the two compositions will not be crossafaded. There will be a pause, or a break between the two… just as you’re used to hearing from the film.

>>>Here's a question for Doug, maybe you've answered it before. Will the chronology of the ROTK CR follow the original cut that Shore scored (i.e. Gandalf arriving at Minas Tirith during the retreat from Osgiliath), will it follow that of the theatrical/extended editions, or will it be sort of a combination of the two?>>>

That’s an excellent question… so here’s an awful answer! I don’t know. No one knows. The decision has not yet been made. Currently, both versions of this music are being restored / remixed. Howard will make the final call as to which will be used… or both… or neither. Well ok, there obviously won’t be a situation where neither is used. There, at least I was able to include a little concrete information.

There is some music that is unique to the version of the chronology that has Gandalf arrive during the battle outside Osgiliath… if this music does not make the CR, you can count on hearing it eventually, I’m quite certain.

I’m still working through the next draft of the notes right now. Specifically, the included music examples have been in the spotlight lately. Track breakdowns and titles for the second and third discs have also been on the table. Marching forwards…

Best,

>>>Doug, are those two sections of music going to be pieced together, or is the later going to be a short track following the Beacon track?????>>>

The track breaks are currently being discussed, as are track titles, so comments are a bit premature. The two sections were recorded separately, however, just fyi. Also remember, a track break does not necessarily indicate any specific length of silence between the compositions -- that’s adjustable. I can at least tell you that the two compositions will not be crossafaded. There will be a pause, or a break between the two… just as you’re used to hearing from the film.

I’m still working through the next draft of the notes right now. Specifically, the included music examples have been in the spotlight lately. Track breakdowns and titles for the second and third discs have also been on the table. Marching forwards…
Best,
-Doug
<<<<<<<<<<

THANKYOU DOUG (FOR SHARING YOUR TIME WITH US!!!!)!!!!!!!!

But there was a comment that was meant to be a question,
>>>
I hope what I am about to say is not the case, and is proved wrong, but I have a feeling that the last disc is going to contain all the music from the Fan Credits of all three films................please, don't let this be the case, I want to hear 4 hours and 30 minutes of Return Of The King music......<<<<<

Question----------Doug, are all 4 discs going to be just of Return Of The King music, or........well.....you've read above comment....???????

Another Question--------do you know if any tracks are going to exceed 20 minutes or 30 minutes??????

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I hope what I am about to say is not the case, and is proved wrong, but I have a feeling that the last disc is going to contain all the music from the Fan Credits of all three films................please, don't let this be the case, I want to hear 4 hours and 30 minutes of Return Of The King music......<<<<<

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I think on the rarities disc should be alternate tracks like the film version of "Flight to the Ford" etc.

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Originally posted by Magpie:
I suppose most of the fan credit music is redundant, but not Sissel's song nor Bilbo's Song. Those deserve a CD release somehow, somewhere. I think Use Well the Days deserves it, as well.

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Digging in again, see below, if you’d be so kind.

>>>So do you think this thing will be out by Novemberish of this year?>>>

Honestly, don’t know. As before, the release date is entirely in the hands of the label, so this is their call. I suppose I could guess and say, yes, it seems we’re progressing according to a timeline that would tend to suggest fourth quarter… but as soon as I say that, I’m sure they’ll say they want it on shelves next week.

And if so, I’d advise you all to go out and buy Starbucks stock, because there won’t be a lot of sleeping going on!

>>>Wouldn't it just be grand to have the Fan Club Credits tracks on the Rarities disc?>>>

The rarities disc is looking quite, quite full right now… There’s just a mountain of material we proposing for this. As is pointed out below, the fan credits are already out there in the world… in good sound to boot. It’s probably unlikely that we’ll be able to / inclined to dedicate disc space to something that’s essentially a redundant presentation. However, pieces such as Sissel’s song, Bilbo’s Song, which only appear in the fan scroll music will certainly need to be presented. (As will Use Well The Days, as Magpie adroitly notes.)

Remember, you are well within your legal rights to rip the fan scroll music to CD for your personal use, if you are so inclined.

>>>Doug, are those two sections of music going to be pieced together, or is the later going to be a short track following the Beacon track?????>>>

They say repetition is the soul of wit… wait, no they don’t. Anyway, see below, if I may resort to quoting myself:

>>>The track breaks are currently being discussed, as are track titles, so comments are a bit premature.>>>

So in short. I dunno!

>>>Question----------Doug, are all 4 discs going to be just of Return Of The King music, or........well.....you've read above comment....???????>>>

All ROTK, all the time! There is no plan to plan to represent anything other than the complete, glorious score to ROTK on these four discs. It’s an exhausting, incredibly rewarding listening experience. It’s funny how it can make you feel that you’ve accomplished something even if you’ve simply been sittingstill for the duration. It’s just such a complete, involving piece. I know I sound like a shill again, but man…

>>>Another Question--------do you know if any tracks are going to exceed 20 minutes or 30 minutes??????>>>

Currently, no. This could change, but I suspect it’s highly unlikely.

>>>Sorry for asking, but I don't understand. There will be a ROTK CR of course...but will this "rarities" disc even come out, or is it just a wistful desire, and what else would be on this disc aside from the fan credits?>>>

The Rarities disc will showcase unused drafts, early ideas, alternates, etc. It’s on the docket, currently, not simply a pipedream. Still early on of course, but full steam ahead.

>>>I think on the rarities disc should be alternate tracks like the film version of "Flight to the Ford" etc.>>>

Oh, but there’s another version yet!

>>>Heck, if anyone wants the fan club credits I have them on mp3s, it's about 70 minutes or so and is a good listen. I don't want to hear it on the ROTK:CR though.>>>

Again, just to play rumor-killer, you won’t, don’t worry.

There you are, all.

More when news warrants!

Secondly, Use Well The Days ... what a beautiful song, and, at this point the face turns towards Doug, could it be that there are two versions of this song as well?
Because the sheet music that is available doesn't exactly match the version available on the ROTK Bonus DVD.
Especially the second refrain seems a lot more grandioso in the sheet music, with those triplets.

In fact, I've often wondered what fully composed end credit tracks for the theatrical versions of the films would have sounded like in place of the songs for the end. I appreciate the notion that the audience would be quite tired of more underscore by the end (the same reason Celine Dion was enlisted for TITANIC), but I'd love to have heard an uninhibited orchestral journey through the worlds of each film.

Take ROTK - imagine if that Das Rheingold inspired-Coda from Shore developed over nine minutes, with hints of melodic ideas from the films flitting over the surging textures... it would just reclaim the whole musiscal enterprise for the composer Shore is.

And for that rarity disc, which Doug confirmed above: on the supplementary of Fellowship (Disc 3), for a documentary of an early draft of the prologue, there's a [u]GREAT[/u] piece of Nazgûl music with unknown choral text. I remember seeing this and going through the ceiling with unpassed glee.

So, dearest Doug, if you don't want me to...do...something...rash...make sure that unused piece is on that rarity disc!!! More pints for you if it's there!

Same here!

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Originally posted by Olorin:
It sounds like the rarities disc could easily be 2 discs. But will it be included in the ROTK set, be a standalone release, or be included in Doug's book?

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Originally posted by brutus:
Same here!

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